Such great story telling! Your experience adds insight into what so many women feel is lacking in our relationships. A connection we only feel when we’re literally in the room with our other, that dissipates as soon as there’s any distance. Great stuff.
Thanks Rosie! As much as I adore podcasting, crafting agonizing memoir-meets-cultural-observation stories like this is my first creative love. I’m so glad you enjoyed it!
If his story is true, I’m sure you meant a lot to this man during that time of his life. AND….eff him. That wasn’t ok at all, leaving you on read. He knows what he did. Go forth, good soul and find a real one
I’ve listened to enough betrayal podcast stories to know that “my ex wife has cancer” is a typical cover story for a cheating man. The untouchable alibi. Maybe Mason’s situation was true, but the story is typical for the men living double lives (and there are a LOT more men doing this than women realize, the numbers are staggering). It took me a long time to realize that silence from a man in between dates usually means he is with another woman, or other women. Either dating multiples, or in a long term relationship. (The reverse is usually not true for women). I have a good guy friend who is a retired serial cheater and he told me “the only time a man doesn’t text a woman is work and when he’s with another woman, and can’t afford to get caught”. And apparently the majority of separated/divorced Gen x men are enjoying multiple women and simply lying about it. For some reason all of us women have never got the memo… and we continue on struggling with making excuses for them “maybe he is avoidant”. No… our very first thought should be “maybe he is with another woman”. It’s amazing to me that this is not even ever a consideration, that we take men for their word 100% and never even CONSIDER this alternative which happens over and over and over again at alarming rates. Dating apps have made it extremely easy for Gen x men to live double lives and date multiple women and just lie to them all. And almost always they use their children as an excuse. If they need an added excuse, wife with cancer would be perfect. Since they’re not intending long-term anyways it doesn’t matter, they probably won’t get caught. Women are afraid to consider the possibility that there might be other women because they are terrified of being labelled insecure, suspicious etc - labels that really work for men to keep us in line. And what happens is thousands of women daily turn a blind eye to what’s actually happening. Coming up with all sorts of romantic excuses for the man such as avoidant personality, but never once acknowledging the elephant in the room. And this is precisely how men get away with it.
Ooof. You may be right, and this is precisely why I needed to hear from him—to build trust. I did call him at times when he claimed to be there, and he was (it was FaceTime, so video, or I could hear him talking with his daughters).
But you’re right—he very well could have also been sneaking around. I will never know. And thankfully, now it doesn’t matter.
I am so glad you are open to hearing this. We are socialized to always give the benefit of the doubt, take men at their word, and come up with excuses for behaviour we don’t understand or like. But gen x men have had decades to perfect their game so that it’s almost impossible to catch them in a lie, the only real sign of womanizing is “inconsistency in communication”. Your article focused on how it doesn’t work for you regardless of the reason and I agree that’s exactly the right way to look at it. I just want other women to “get the memo” because the double life thing is happening at alarming rates, and women suffer from STD’s more than men
On my first date with my (now late) husband, he walked me home afterwards. On the way back, I stepped into a pile of dog poop. My date didn't laugh at me - he just said, "Wait, I'll clean it up." He found a fallen branch and cleaned the poop off my shoes. I know then that this is what I need in life - a man who will clean my shit after me... (Regarding the between-date time, I personally never had an issue with silence; we were both leading busy lives. But that's a matter of personal preference.)
It's going to drive me nuts never knowing if his storyline was even true, or if he made up all of his gut-wrenching circumstances to keep you at arm's length.
Girl SAME!! I mean, I saw photos of his daughters and ex. We video called from her house. They existed. I believe the story is true. I believe he was caring for them when he said he was. Is it possible he was lying? Sure. But my gut says no.
What I believe WAS happening? He had a profound avoidant attachment style, and likely (undiagnosed or treated) ADHD and depression. And his family’s situation served as a perfect mask, a way to hide from accountability. He got the physical and emotional intimacy he wanted but entirely on his terms and with little space for my needs. I wish it could have been manageable because I truly cared for this man and had so much empathy for his situation. I wanted to help him, and would have, if he’d been able to let me in. In the end, he wasn’t.
Was he frazzled? Was he not that into me? Was he lying? I will never know. But this story is the closest accounting of the truth I could write.
This, lol. I kept waiting to read it was all just a ruse.
Even so, he wasn't capable of being in a relationship and shouldn't have been trying to date when he was so focused elsewhere. It's crappy to advertise oneself as emotionally available and ready for a relationship and then do the opposite, no matter the reason.
Eleanor, thank you—you’re 💯 right here. It wasn’t kind, the way he failed to show up for me. I’m choosing to give him the grace that sometimes we don’t know our emotional limitations till we butt up against them.
I am the female version of the person who needs quiet and personal space at the between spaces. As a true introvert, it would destroy me to have to be in contact with ANYONE that many times a day. Not about the other person at all. It is where I revive, on my own. I would feel like I was imprisoned if I had to respond at the same time every single day. I would feel like vomiting if someone said "you usually call at X time - where were you?" Um, I was living my life, on my timeline.
I am being honest about my communication style. I will try to communicate with you more often. But - if that doesn't work for you, then you are right, we don't have the tools to be compatible. I love being with you, I love planning activities for us, I love doing things for one another.
But I can never be accountable for 100% of my time. It makes the introvert, private me feel strangled if that is what you need. If I am painting or baking or reading or sleeping, I cannot interrupt those activities to allay your anxieties. Honestly, I am happy with who I am and how I live my life. I don't live with regular anxiety of any kind. Spaces - between anything - are my jam and give me peace.
There is nothing wrong with you, we are just not compatible.
This is such an important conversation to have - with all people in our lives.
I guess the bottom line is that I cannot be your everything. I cannot be anyone's everything.
I didn't get the impression that Dana's need for in between date connection was anywhere close to what you're describing as intolerable. She never said she wanted messages at the same time every day, for example.
Thanks Liz, you’re correct. This whole relationship was four-months, round-trip. We were sexually exclusive almost immediately. My request was at least once a day I needed to hear from him—a call, a text, whatever.
For some, that might be too much.
But since I only saw him 1-2 evenings a week, yeah. A check-in was not a negotiable. I don’t think he was ever really in it, so it was a good way to force me to end things.
Nancy, I completely agree—some people just aren’t compatible and it’s so necessary to be honest about who we are and state what we need. Thanks for your comment!
I’m divorced after a very long marriage. I encountered this same BDB issue with a couple of guys that otherwise would have had a lot of potential. We had a nice couple of dates, but the silence between dates was deafening. Neither had any sort of major life events like you described. I even mentioned, very directly, that not hearing from them at all between dates made me feel like I wasn’t important. When the situation remained the same I cut my losses. I’m a Gen X woman as well so maybe it’s specific to men our age. 🤷🏼♀️
Another resource sparked by “Sex in the City” is the book “He’s Just Not Into You.”
The book is still worth reading. I remember when it came out, men were angry because it taught women how men thought. It basically said,”If a man is into you, he will move mountains to talk to you or be with you. If he ignores you for days, he’s not into you. Move on.”
This man wasn’t into the author. Don’t waste the pretty.
Ending it took courage—good for you—you deserve so much better! I suspect the same thing as Joy. His silence between dates suggested he was otherwise occupied—and not caring for his ex and kids. His silence at the end was such a tell of bad character, whether or not he was deceptive.
This 100% resonated with me. I have been in similar situations in the past and broken up with the guy over text as well. However, I would not do the same now.
My main thought was this: it sounds like the connection was real for both you and him. He couldn’t or wouldn’t give you what you wanted, but he did care. I’m sure your breakup text really hurt him.
I have personally realized in the past year that when I get anxious I react just to get rid of the feeling, even if it is immediately replaced by sadness, guilt, and most importantly a feeling of regret that I acted impulsively. It is really hard to learn to sit with the feeling until you can talk about it. Even if the outcome most likely would have been the same, an in person or over the phone two sided conversation would have left both of you with a better understanding of each other as well as a better overall ending to a relationship that gave you joy.
The story continued on, over text. I ended up reaching out and trying to meet. I waited weeks for a response before finally blocking him. It was too hard to keep waiting to see if he’d respond and be let down.
A part of me still hopes he’s going to show up at my doorsteps with flowers and an apology, even now.
I know it won’t happen. So I had to block him and let him gradually fade.
Writing it down, and reading all your comments, is good medicine.
And if I’d listened to Jennie and followed all the BHDM rules, I would’ve B2B him from the start. So many rhetorical patterns. Sigh.
Such great story telling! Your experience adds insight into what so many women feel is lacking in our relationships. A connection we only feel when we’re literally in the room with our other, that dissipates as soon as there’s any distance. Great stuff.
Thanks Rosie! As much as I adore podcasting, crafting agonizing memoir-meets-cultural-observation stories like this is my first creative love. I’m so glad you enjoyed it!
Glad you are figuring out and honoring what you need and deserve from a partner. The romance stuff is addictive, but the "bdb" is where it's at!
Yeah, but sigh. I need both. Hence, why I am typically single. SIGH AGAIN. 😏
Oh for sure, non-negotiable! 😁😘
If his story is true, I’m sure you meant a lot to this man during that time of his life. AND….eff him. That wasn’t ok at all, leaving you on read. He knows what he did. Go forth, good soul and find a real one
“Go forth, good soul, and find a real one.”
Girl, I’M TRYING. 💜
I’ve listened to enough betrayal podcast stories to know that “my ex wife has cancer” is a typical cover story for a cheating man. The untouchable alibi. Maybe Mason’s situation was true, but the story is typical for the men living double lives (and there are a LOT more men doing this than women realize, the numbers are staggering). It took me a long time to realize that silence from a man in between dates usually means he is with another woman, or other women. Either dating multiples, or in a long term relationship. (The reverse is usually not true for women). I have a good guy friend who is a retired serial cheater and he told me “the only time a man doesn’t text a woman is work and when he’s with another woman, and can’t afford to get caught”. And apparently the majority of separated/divorced Gen x men are enjoying multiple women and simply lying about it. For some reason all of us women have never got the memo… and we continue on struggling with making excuses for them “maybe he is avoidant”. No… our very first thought should be “maybe he is with another woman”. It’s amazing to me that this is not even ever a consideration, that we take men for their word 100% and never even CONSIDER this alternative which happens over and over and over again at alarming rates. Dating apps have made it extremely easy for Gen x men to live double lives and date multiple women and just lie to them all. And almost always they use their children as an excuse. If they need an added excuse, wife with cancer would be perfect. Since they’re not intending long-term anyways it doesn’t matter, they probably won’t get caught. Women are afraid to consider the possibility that there might be other women because they are terrified of being labelled insecure, suspicious etc - labels that really work for men to keep us in line. And what happens is thousands of women daily turn a blind eye to what’s actually happening. Coming up with all sorts of romantic excuses for the man such as avoidant personality, but never once acknowledging the elephant in the room. And this is precisely how men get away with it.
Ooof. You may be right, and this is precisely why I needed to hear from him—to build trust. I did call him at times when he claimed to be there, and he was (it was FaceTime, so video, or I could hear him talking with his daughters).
But you’re right—he very well could have also been sneaking around. I will never know. And thankfully, now it doesn’t matter.
I am so glad you are open to hearing this. We are socialized to always give the benefit of the doubt, take men at their word, and come up with excuses for behaviour we don’t understand or like. But gen x men have had decades to perfect their game so that it’s almost impossible to catch them in a lie, the only real sign of womanizing is “inconsistency in communication”. Your article focused on how it doesn’t work for you regardless of the reason and I agree that’s exactly the right way to look at it. I just want other women to “get the memo” because the double life thing is happening at alarming rates, and women suffer from STD’s more than men
And layer in the fact men are increasingly bad with condom usage with age… yeah. It’s scary out there.
Agreed…his behaviour reeks of cheating. These double lives are mind boggling and yes, more common than one would think.
We're all slowly learning.
Potential means nothing -- it's all about the present.
And BDB is a smart way for looking at the present.
Thank you for the good read.
Very well-stated!
On my first date with my (now late) husband, he walked me home afterwards. On the way back, I stepped into a pile of dog poop. My date didn't laugh at me - he just said, "Wait, I'll clean it up." He found a fallen branch and cleaned the poop off my shoes. I know then that this is what I need in life - a man who will clean my shit after me... (Regarding the between-date time, I personally never had an issue with silence; we were both leading busy lives. But that's a matter of personal preference.)
Oh my gosh—that was truly above and beyond. 💜
Beautiful and so poignant. I've been there. Now alone. Alone IS better. No more mylanta. Sending love. ❤️
It's going to drive me nuts never knowing if his storyline was even true, or if he made up all of his gut-wrenching circumstances to keep you at arm's length.
Girl SAME!! I mean, I saw photos of his daughters and ex. We video called from her house. They existed. I believe the story is true. I believe he was caring for them when he said he was. Is it possible he was lying? Sure. But my gut says no.
What I believe WAS happening? He had a profound avoidant attachment style, and likely (undiagnosed or treated) ADHD and depression. And his family’s situation served as a perfect mask, a way to hide from accountability. He got the physical and emotional intimacy he wanted but entirely on his terms and with little space for my needs. I wish it could have been manageable because I truly cared for this man and had so much empathy for his situation. I wanted to help him, and would have, if he’d been able to let me in. In the end, he wasn’t.
Was he frazzled? Was he not that into me? Was he lying? I will never know. But this story is the closest accounting of the truth I could write.
This, lol. I kept waiting to read it was all just a ruse.
Even so, he wasn't capable of being in a relationship and shouldn't have been trying to date when he was so focused elsewhere. It's crappy to advertise oneself as emotionally available and ready for a relationship and then do the opposite, no matter the reason.
Eleanor, thank you—you’re 💯 right here. It wasn’t kind, the way he failed to show up for me. I’m choosing to give him the grace that sometimes we don’t know our emotional limitations till we butt up against them.
I am the female version of the person who needs quiet and personal space at the between spaces. As a true introvert, it would destroy me to have to be in contact with ANYONE that many times a day. Not about the other person at all. It is where I revive, on my own. I would feel like I was imprisoned if I had to respond at the same time every single day. I would feel like vomiting if someone said "you usually call at X time - where were you?" Um, I was living my life, on my timeline.
I am being honest about my communication style. I will try to communicate with you more often. But - if that doesn't work for you, then you are right, we don't have the tools to be compatible. I love being with you, I love planning activities for us, I love doing things for one another.
But I can never be accountable for 100% of my time. It makes the introvert, private me feel strangled if that is what you need. If I am painting or baking or reading or sleeping, I cannot interrupt those activities to allay your anxieties. Honestly, I am happy with who I am and how I live my life. I don't live with regular anxiety of any kind. Spaces - between anything - are my jam and give me peace.
There is nothing wrong with you, we are just not compatible.
This is such an important conversation to have - with all people in our lives.
I guess the bottom line is that I cannot be your everything. I cannot be anyone's everything.
I will always advocate for my peace.
I didn't get the impression that Dana's need for in between date connection was anywhere close to what you're describing as intolerable. She never said she wanted messages at the same time every day, for example.
Thanks Liz, you’re correct. This whole relationship was four-months, round-trip. We were sexually exclusive almost immediately. My request was at least once a day I needed to hear from him—a call, a text, whatever.
For some, that might be too much.
But since I only saw him 1-2 evenings a week, yeah. A check-in was not a negotiable. I don’t think he was ever really in it, so it was a good way to force me to end things.
It worked.
Nancy, I completely agree—some people just aren’t compatible and it’s so necessary to be honest about who we are and state what we need. Thanks for your comment!
I’m divorced after a very long marriage. I encountered this same BDB issue with a couple of guys that otherwise would have had a lot of potential. We had a nice couple of dates, but the silence between dates was deafening. Neither had any sort of major life events like you described. I even mentioned, very directly, that not hearing from them at all between dates made me feel like I wasn’t important. When the situation remained the same I cut my losses. I’m a Gen X woman as well so maybe it’s specific to men our age. 🤷🏼♀️
I’m 68, so a Jones Generation Boomer. Men in my age group do this, too.
It never ends, does it? 😏
Sounds like Mason did not have the emotional allotment you deserved. Maybe in a different time and place.
This is my sad conclusion as well...
Thanks for reading and commenting--I really appreciate it!
Another resource sparked by “Sex in the City” is the book “He’s Just Not Into You.”
The book is still worth reading. I remember when it came out, men were angry because it taught women how men thought. It basically said,”If a man is into you, he will move mountains to talk to you or be with you. If he ignores you for days, he’s not into you. Move on.”
This man wasn’t into the author. Don’t waste the pretty.
I want to get “don’t waste the pretty” on a t-shirt. What a great mantra!
Oh come on, don't delude yourself. He was rooting somebody else. And his ex was doing most or all of the childcare.
Ending it took courage—good for you—you deserve so much better! I suspect the same thing as Joy. His silence between dates suggested he was otherwise occupied—and not caring for his ex and kids. His silence at the end was such a tell of bad character, whether or not he was deceptive.
It really was. He is at a minimum a huge emotional coward. And thankfully you, I appreciate your comment and your kind words. 💜
I don't think I'll ever be able to date again. I'm so not ready for these kind of things...
Yeah… they’re not my favorite either…
Am I the only one who thinks how abhorrent it is for this man to date while his wife is dying? I would’ve walked away immediately.
This 100% resonated with me. I have been in similar situations in the past and broken up with the guy over text as well. However, I would not do the same now.
My main thought was this: it sounds like the connection was real for both you and him. He couldn’t or wouldn’t give you what you wanted, but he did care. I’m sure your breakup text really hurt him.
I have personally realized in the past year that when I get anxious I react just to get rid of the feeling, even if it is immediately replaced by sadness, guilt, and most importantly a feeling of regret that I acted impulsively. It is really hard to learn to sit with the feeling until you can talk about it. Even if the outcome most likely would have been the same, an in person or over the phone two sided conversation would have left both of you with a better understanding of each other as well as a better overall ending to a relationship that gave you joy.
Beautifully stated.
The story continued on, over text. I ended up reaching out and trying to meet. I waited weeks for a response before finally blocking him. It was too hard to keep waiting to see if he’d respond and be let down.
A part of me still hopes he’s going to show up at my doorsteps with flowers and an apology, even now.
I know it won’t happen. So I had to block him and let him gradually fade.
Writing it down, and reading all your comments, is good medicine.
And if I’d listened to Jennie and followed all the BHDM rules, I would’ve B2B him from the start. So many rhetorical patterns. Sigh.
Oh my goodness, we’re so curious to see his rhetorical patterns now!